Makar vs Hughes, who would you build your franchise around?

[Fogghorn]

We've had a few posts on the two of them. Seems to me this conversation is going to go on for the next decade if they remain healthy so why not start a thread.

At the beginning of the year I thought if they both stayed healthy they would be sure fire future Hockey Hall of Famers. Perhaps even amongst the top 25 dmen of all time. I also thought Makar was the slightly better dman, but given that Hughes was a year younger and never played on a good team he had slightly more potential career wise than Makar.

I've changed my opinion. Hughes is the better dman, and will continue to be. Hughes is the best player the Canucks have ever had. And had moved his game up to a level that surpasses Makar. He's the third dman to achieve 200 assists over 3 seasons, Coffey and Orr being the others. And the teams those two played on were far superior to the Canucks and the eras they played in far more conducive to scoring goals. How good do you have to be to get those kinds of numbers with two years of crappy Canucks teams, in this day and age?

Can a little guy be good at defense? Hell YES!

among the 120 NHL defencemen who have played at least 1000 5-on-5 minutes this season, Quinn Hughes has the fourth-lowest rate of shot attempts against when he’s on the ice. Makar is 56th.

https://www.vancouverisawesome.com/canu ... se-8561908" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I still think Makar will win the Norris. I'm not sure the eastern press realize how good Hughes is. I also think if Hughes stays healthy over his career he is likely to become recognized as the best American dman ever. Surpassing guys like Chelios and Leetch. One of the top 10 dman of all time.

[Pokecheque]

Tough decision. My biases have me lean toward Cale, obviously. The one thing that would hold me back is the fact that Makar is extremely injury prone, and right now is clearly trying to play through something that will likely require major surgery to correct. Quinn might not play as punishing a style, and might be more durable overall (hopefully more durable than his big brother Jack).

I think Quinn is better defensively, but Cale is the more explosive, more dynamic offensive catalyst. Whether that changes over time, we'll see.

[E.L.]

If we're talking about building from the ground up, I think Hughes might be more capable of succeeding with less around him than Makar. I don't know why I feel that, I don't think it relates to their current circumstances (they're both on great teams).

[Pokecheque]

If we're talking about building from the ground up, I think Hughes might be more capable of succeeding with less around him than Makar. I don't know why I feel that, I don't think it relates to their current circumstances (they're both on great teams).

I suppose it's the coaching. Makar has only had one, Bednar, while Quinn has had, what, three now? And one could argue (I wouldn't) that none of them are particularly good. Also, Makar has, arguably, had better talent in front of him and below him on the depth chart, whereas I still think the Canucks defensive corps is quite bad beyond that top pairing.

[Chris18]

McDavid.

[Fogghorn]

I'm becoming less doubtful about Hughes likelihood of winning the Norris, even though I feel he clearly deserves it. I actually think he deserves consideration for the Hart. The reason for the change, is that there folks with votes discussing Hughes for the Hart. I can't see him doing it, dmen almost never win the Hart even though they should. But just being in that conversation indicates to me that maybe there is momentum behind him winning the Norris.

When it comes down to the Hart, are any of McDavid, MacKinnon and Kucherov more important to their teams than Hughes? I think if Hughes didn't play the way he has this year the Nucks don't make the playoffs. He is having a best season of any Canuck in the history of the franchise. Still he's a dman, probably only gets 4th place at best in the Hart voting.

[Bosc]

Still he's a dman, probably only gets 4th place at best in the Hart voting.

*Checks Nick Lidstrom's Hart record* No shame in finishing 4th!

He's making a case for himself(and Bieksa mentioned it on Saturday) but the point totals at the top are hard to ignore. And so is Kucherov's lead over his teammates.

[Fogghorn]

Still he's a dman, probably only gets 4th place at best in the Hart voting.

*Checks Nick Lidstrom's Hart record* No shame in finishing 4th!

He's making a case for himself(and Bieksa mentioned it on Saturday) but the point totals at the top are hard to ignore. And so is Kucherov's lead over his teammates.

I mean Pronger was good, but never Lidstrom level good and yet he won a Hart. If any dman of the last 40 years deserved a Hart it was Lidstrom.

[Fogghorn]

The broadcast later showed a graphic showing where Hughes ranks among defenceman in how many games to reach 300 assists in NHL history: Third behind Bobby Orr (346) and Brian Leetch (368), and one ahead of Paul Coffey (377) and Gary Suter (400)


Considering how good those Bruins teams were, and pretty decent Ranger teams, and how bad the Nucks have been at putting the puck in the net for 4 of Hughes season his pace is amazing. He could definitely be #2 on that list if he had been playing in say Colorado in stead of Vancouver.

If he stays healthy, he will be considered to be one of the top 10 dmen of all time, perhaps even top 5.

[Stinky]

Hutson

[Pokecheque]

I really have no dog in this fight, Makar is obviously putting up huge numbers to start this year, but his underlying stats away from MacKinnon are a tad sobering. Toews' continued decline and absolutely SHIT goaltending is not helping matters.

I'll just say I think you could build around both players. They're both elite franchise-level blueliners. I think Hughes is the less flashy, more well-rounded of the two. I'd take either on my team in a heartbeat.

[Fogghorn]

I really have no dog in this fight, Makar is obviously putting up huge numbers to start this year, but his underlying stats away from MacKinnon are a tad sobering. Toews' continued decline and absolutely SHIT goaltending is not helping matters.

I'll just say I think you could build around both players. They're both elite franchise-level blueliners. I think Hughes is the less flashy, more well-rounded of the two. I'd take either on my team in a heartbeat.

Aw man, you just sucked out all the fun of this conversation.

But you're right, if I was GM, I'd be happy to build my franchise around either and consider myself blessedly lucky to have one, but I'd prefer Hughes at this point.