OffThePost.org

For purely selfish reasons I hope they don't figure it out right away, but I do hope they figure it out. There may have been some debate a little while ago, but is absolute none now--the Canucks have by far their best center (and IMO best player PERIOD) in their history, and their best defenseman in their history, and it's not particularly close. And if he can stay healthy, Demko has a legit shot at being the greatest Canucks netminder ever. That's the three most important components toward building a contender IMO right there. They've gotta give it a shot here, but they gotta quit fucking things up by wasting cap space on aging grinders. They also better figure out sooner rather than later that Rick Tocchet is a good assistant coach, but he's not a good head coach.

I still laugh whenever Wyatt Arndt (interesting fella BTW, he's a huge wrestling fan and pumps the local pro wrestling league up there in Canada regularly) makes a "Chaos Giraffe" reference. Nothing describes Tyler Myers better. I've never seen a player with such talent and size seemingly unable to truly utilize either. Just so damned clumsy and awkward anywhere he goes on the ice. Arndt posted a short video of the opposition lining up to take a shot, Myers just skids on by like a Chevy pickup that blew a tire, while Hronek very expertly lays out with the two pad stack and blocks it.

Speaking of Hronek, he's turning out to be a great pickup at least. Fun fact that I'm sure I've spewed out repeatedly on here: Detroit selected him with a pick that originally belonged to the Avs.

I think Pettersson might be their best centre ever, although Hank Sedin makes it a debate. There is no doubt that Hughes is their best dman ever and if he continues to grow maybe more likely their all time mvp player. I didn't think he was better than EP40 last year but it was close, and its way early this year but he's certainly been better than EP40 this year, and Pettersson is off to a very good start. We're talking Nick Lidstrom or Ray Bourque in their prime levels of dominance. A generational level player.

Of course, I'm a fan, and very biased. Wait until you watch them play a full game vs the Av's and let me know what you think?

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Shoresy, "It's called a sweater"

That should be fun, though the smack talk that goes down on HF whenever the Canucks and Avs face off between Makar and Hughes pushers was tiresome years ago, it's exhausting now.

Even in their Stanley Cup year, the Avs kinda struggled with the Canucks IIRC, they have a tough time containing Mr. Pettersson. Also, Garland likely has an extra-big chip on his shoulder whenever he faces off against Colorado.

Speaking of Garland, apparently the Nucks are really trying hard to move him for cap space, but have so far been able to do so.

Hughes is definitely the Canucks story so far this year, he is demonstrating another level of play. PDG is the biggest surprise to me though, at this point I'm thinking he'll get 20 goals and I never would have thought that in the off season.

I'm admittedly giddy, but you'll have to forgive me, I mean I know it's 6 games in but when was the last time we were in a playoff position at anytime during the season?

I definitely agreed on this last year. I'm not so certain about it now. He seems to have reached JT Miller in a way no one ever has before. Since Horvat left JTM has produced at a rate that places him in the top 11 centers in the league. Plus his intensity and defensive consistency has amped way up.

Then there is this quote from EP40 regarding Tocchet.



I've always pictured Tocchet as rather old school, someone who coaches like he played. Focused, intense, north-south, go str8 through someone and never around them. Tortorella but with more diplomacy. That may just have been my biases because that statement from EP40 that Tocchet understands that Pettersson plays better without stress shows an awareness and flexibility to different players and their respective approaches to the game that I didn't think he would have.

And as Oz mentioned Phil Di Giuseppe has been really good on the Boeser/Miller line. The guy is 30, bounced around the league and yet he's bumped Garland, Beuvillier down the lineup. That Tocchet has found a way to get more out of PDG is a positive indicator. Its early, but I've at least opened my mind a bit to the possibility that I'm wrong about Tocchet.

Although there is this, the Canucks are below the league average in time in the offensive and above average in their defensive zone. Those are worrisome stats, and indicate to me their goalies are carrying them. So if the goal tending falters the team in in trouble. On the other hand, if they can find an average RHD replacement for Chaos Giraffe, then I'd bet they make a significant improvement in those zone stats.

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Shoresy, "It's called a sweater"

There may not be a better coach in the league at handling disparate personalities in any given locker room than Rick Tocchet. He received a ton of praise, rightly or wrongly, for "handling" Phil Kessel. Not surprising the relationship between Kessel and Mike Sullivan, not to mention a few other players, fell completely apart once Toc left.

And that, conversely, is (reportedly) NOT a strong suit of Bruce Boudreau's.

That said, when it comes to the Xs and Os of the game, just the pure tactics of the game, that's (again, reportedly) where Tocchet falls short. So in essence, he's a fantastic assistant coach, especially for a head coach who may not always handle certain demanding players with the utmost tact.

So maybe he's just the right guy, and maybe I'm way off-base and he is indeed ready to be a head coach. Only time will tell. At this point he's at least not making any maddening decisions when it comes to deployment and usage that coaches with an "old school" mentality have a tendency to do.

And, not to try and just diminish what Tocchet is accomplishing with JTM, but I think it helped immensely that they got rid of Horvat. I guess there was some reeeeally bad blood between those two, and players were taking sides.

You're right, those are the three most important players for a contender. Thing is the next two most important are imo a #2 centre that plays to the level of #1 centre for most teams in the league. And a high quality #2 defencemen. A good 40 goal wing sniper would also be a big plus.

Well they lack that 40 goal sniper but Hronek is definitely a quality #2 dman. And JT Miller continues to play at a point production that would place him in the top 10 centres in the league. He's even added discipline to his defensive game. They have the key pieces now but lack the quality supporting players.

Their wingers are fine, whether their #3 and #4 centres are good enough remains to be seen. It's their defense that is the real problem. The question that I've been wondering for over a week is if they should go for it this year? Do they make a big trade for a high quality #3 RH dman and give up prospects or draft picks. I've been 10 years of yelling at Benning to not give up prospects, and now finding myself wondering if this is the time? They presently have more talented prospects then anytime I can ever recall in 20 years. You have to go back to the days of Kesler, Bieksa, and Burrows being on the farm team to find a time where they had more talent in the pipeline.

Would this be enough to be in contention? It's not like in the past where they'd be blowing their whole wad on giving up one quality prospect, and a 2nd round pick plus any or all of Garland/Beauvillier/Myers. I think it puts them in contention. But its fragile, I am doubtful they have the depth to handle an injury to one of their top people and still contend. Still I kind of think they have to do it this year, if only because they can't keep playing Hughes/Hronek 25 minutes a night. Improving the 2nd pair means less minutes for them, and strengthens the 3rd pairing by bumping Myer's out of the lineup. It also really helps with their zone control issues that are presently a significant concern.

Canucksarmy posted a piece today on whether they should go for it or not. They differ than me in that they're actually not willing to give up prospects for this. I'm not sure you get that high quality dman without giving up prospects. If you do, I think you have to give up Boeser or Kuzmenko for him. And I don't think if they want to contend that they can let either of these two go.

https://canucksarmy.com/news/second-no- ... canucks-go

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Shoresy, "It's called a sweater"

If Calgary's getting close to blowing it up, Tanev could probably be had for a pick and I think Calgary would be fine taking on someone like, say, Myers to make it happen.

Is this a GO FOR IT year? I'm not sure. Canucks have gotten great goaltending and team shooting percentage is 2nd in the league behind Los Angeles. I dunno...I'd be wary.

I am wary, I would not make the trade yet but I'd be considering it. If I was management I'd be backing off moving Garland right now for that C+ grade dman they are looking for. I'd wait until January and see how the team is performing and if it does look like it can contend make the move for an above average dman at that time. Garland can be moved as part of the deal or move him in a separate deal that needs to be done to make the primary deal happen.

In the meantime, I'd resign Ethan Bear, he is due to return from injury in December. He is serviceable as a 2nd pairing RHD, they just need some cap space to make that happen......which maybe tough. If they can sign him, and then make the trade, he'd be a very solid 3rd pairing dman. That would be a team that could pose challenges in the playoffs.

I'm still kinda in shock that I'm even thinking like this. I've have the attitude of go slow for so long but the 5 key pieces needed for a cup run are there. Those players are very hard to acquire, teams don't get that many opportunities for that kinda core. Supporting pieces are much easier to pick up, so it should at least be considered imo.

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Shoresy, "It's called a sweater"

and yes I think Tanev could be a good acquisition. He never wanted to leave, rumour has it that he'd like to return, and his contract expires this year so he'd be cheap to get. I'm not sure I'd still consider him a B+ level talent but get him now (forget about Bear) and then if the team plays well into January get the strong RHD they need. Taneve on 3rd pairing and able to move up in case of injury would be fantastic.

And to think we got Meyer's leading to Tanev having to leave due to cap constraints...............Benning is an idiot.

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Shoresy, "It's called a sweater"

Bloody Canucks, couldn't hold the shutout for Demko. Never cease to dissappoint.

When it was 4 zip I was pretty pleased, thinking that's the way very good teams handle bottom feeders. No surprises, just get the job done, but then holy crap, 10 goals. When was the last time the Nucks had 10 goals?

I had the chance to draft both TJ Miller and Boeser but thought to myself that I didn't want to do a Butch, and go all biased homer fanatic and overload my team with Nucks. Seems it was another of my bad drafting decisions.

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Shoresy, "It's called a sweater"

They put 10 by the Wings fairly recently, didn't they? Pretty sure that they hit double digits.

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Thanks Chuck, E.L. and Harmy!

They haven't played the wings yet. They did beat the Oilers 8-1 opening night though.............that was a good one.

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Shoresy, "It's called a sweater"

2-0 Nucks over Dallas. Dallas is a good team, I was looking at this game as being a really good and fair test for the Nucks. The Nucks were everything I wanted, sticking to their game. After falling behind 2 nothing Dallas opened up in the 3rd and took risks catching the Canucks in SOG but the Canucks deserved this win. Although part of it is that Demko is > Oetteninger

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Shoresy, "It's called a sweater"

Playing around with NHL Edge player stats profile (this tool is pretty cool).

For goalies the NHL average for high danger chances is a .785 save percentage. Thatcher Demko is .971%..... :

The guy is better % at high danger than mid range of .918%

I kind of wish they'd allow me to see a breakdown of home and away games. I'm guessing the definition of high danger is a little softer for the Canucks than other rinks. Either that or we're going to see some serious regression on Demko's part. Or perhaps both.

So his save percentage as compared to the league:

97th percentile short range
69th percentile mid range
below 50th percentile long range.

So the more dangerous the shots, the better he his, the least dangerous areas he's below league average? Just strange. So we can expect his short range to regress, but their could actually be improvement in both mid and long range shots. So hopefully the overall outcome is pretty much a wash and he can maintain his overall goals against average. or perhaps a slight decline which would be perfectly fine.

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Shoresy, "It's called a sweater"

Interesting, Demko getting his 4th straight start against the Oilers tonight. Based on the standings the Oilers are a weak team and this is a good time to draw DeSantis in and give Demko a break. However its the Oilers, a team many thought would challenge for the President's cup this year. A team come April the Canuck's might be duking it out with for a playoff spot. So its a possible 4 point night, and Tocchet is looking ahead and putting his star goalie in to help secure the win. I like that thinking.

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Shoresy, "It's called a sweater"

Oilers players and fans must be dying inside. Get 18 shots on Demko and finally get a goal, then Canucks put 6 shots on Skinner and get 3 goals.

This organization has had many years to get an average goalie, I think they better go begging to Calgary and see what Markstrom would cost them.

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Shoresy, "It's called a sweater"

Starting to feel like the Isles board in here. Just me and my echo. However Chris has been that way since day one, we used to have like 20 others here once upon a time.


Anyways, I know I griped about the Sam Lafferty trade. Felt it was a waste of cap space, and for another forward when we have so damn many. (Aman, Poz, and especially Bains all waiting on the farm and worthy of call up. All better than Joshua and Studnika but they can clear waivers, the latter two can't) Turns out this Lafferty is pretty good, fast wheels, and man does he manage to draw penalties.

I know penalty draws are a stat that is kept, anyone know where I can find them?

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Shoresy, "It's called a sweater"

I used to not come into this forum because there was so many of you, I couldn't even keep track of who was who. And you guys could talk amongst yourselves all year long. Now, I feel for you!

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Posting your political views on social media is like sticking your head up your ass & whispering: You're just as likely to change someone's mind, and you'll always come out looking like a shithead.

Oz drops by once or sometimes twice a week, and think I saw tCL a month ago..........so still a faint trace of hope.............you sir, have no hope!

I didn't really notice before because it was a whole lot of moping, and slamming Benning for almost a decade...........now we actually have something really positive to hope for and talk about..........and I realize its just me...........lol

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Shoresy, "It's called a sweater"