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PostPosted: Fri Feb 05, 2021 12:51 pm 
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Logical Progression wrote:
Fogghorn wrote:
What's worrisome is they're losing really badly, if these were close games I'd think there was hope. At this point I don't expect them to make the playoffs.
Agree. Hard not to believe that wasn't the plan by ownership for this season all along. Maybe they know this season is a throw away due to no gate revenue and they need to plan a new era for next season with the Pettersson and Hughes signings. I am not convinced ownership believes enough in this management team to take them to the next level -- we could be in for a major house cleaning this off season. Did you know that Benning is the second longest tenured GM in Canuck history, trailing only Pat Quinn who had 7 playoff appearances, a SCF and numerous division titles.


I've been saying their future is bright. Two to seven years from now they should be a contender every year. So in a sense I don't mind them being a lottery team this year if that happens. However I really don't understand why they are this bad. On paper the top two lines should be able to play with anyone in the league. Schmidt and Hughes are a very good top two defence and the Demko/Holtby combo should be okay. This should be enough to place them at least middle of the pack despite the weaknesses of the bottom of the lineup. So what the frig is going on? Am I just as a fan so biased I'm just grossly overestimating the ability of our top players?

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PostPosted: Fri Feb 05, 2021 2:02 pm 
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I would never give Aquilini the benefit of the doubt when it comes to forethought. I don't believe for an instant that they were prepared for this.

Some of it is bad luck. I think a LOT of it is bad goaltending. But also, others have pointed out that they just look plain bad in the defensive zone. It's like the defense and forwards aren't on the same page at all. I don't know what to make of that, but IMO this situation reminds me of what I'm witnessing with the Rockies. Weak ownership and incompetent management have a very talented core on their hands but continually restrain it by surrounding it with overpriced chaff.

Pretty sure Jimmy Boy makes it through this unscathed. Green...probably not.


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 05, 2021 7:50 pm 
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Pokecheque wrote:
I would never give Aquilini the benefit of the doubt when it comes to forethought. I don't believe for an instant that they were prepared for this.

Some of it is bad luck. I think a LOT of it is bad goaltending. But also, others have pointed out that they just look plain bad in the defensive zone. It's like the defense and forwards aren't on the same page at all. I don't know what to make of that, but IMO this situation reminds me of what I'm witnessing with the Rockies. Weak ownership and incompetent management have a very talented core on their hands but continually restrain it by surrounding it with overpriced chaff.

Pretty sure Jimmy Boy makes it through this unscathed. Green...probably not.
I dunno. Francesco himself may not have any forethought but the family at large just might. Speculation is running rampant that they have had enough with the way he has been running the team for awhile now throwing money away like candy. The family have run into some financial issues this season with their various businesses (not just Canucks) and may be trying to tighten up the bottom line in preparation for a sale.

They won't pay Green to not coach and don't want to pay a manager not to manage and there is no real interim GM possibility unless they want to turn it over to John not-so Weisbrod. The GM also can't really effect the team much this season because because of complications of trading in a COVID quarantine world. And of course the season is not yet lost as bad as they have been. Calgary and Edmonton aren't exactly running away with the playoff spots. They might fire Green just to effect change this season but that doesn't seem likely due to the financial constraints previously mentioned. I still say off season front office overhaul is definitely in the cards.


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 05, 2021 8:03 pm 
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Logical Progression wrote:
I dunno. Francesco himself may not have any forethought but the family at large just might. Speculation is running rampant that they have had enough with the way he has been running the team for awhile now throwing money away like candy. The family have run into some financial issues this season with their various businesses (not just Canucks) and may be trying to tighten up the bottom line in preparation for a sale.

They won't pay Green to not coach and don't want to pay a manager not to manage and there is no real interim GM possibility unless they want to turn it over to John not-so Weisbrod. The GM also can't really effect the team much this season because because of complications of trading in a COVID quarantine world. And of course the season is not yet lost as bad as they have been. Calgary and Edmonton aren't exactly running away with the playoff spots. They might fire Green just to effect change this season but that doesn't seem likely due to the financial constraints previously mentioned. I still say off season front office overhaul is definitely in the cards.


Well, funny you should mention that because Friedman was asked by Marek about the Sens on today's 31 Thoughts pod and Friedman answered by talking about Ottawa and then Vancouver. Friedman said that there was a quote from Benning regarding the Toffoli negotiations that really made him and the Canucks look bad, and given the bad PR fallout from that and the fact that Toffoli is ragdolling his old team every chance he gets, it appears Jimmy might be in more trouble than I realized.

It's right around the 35-minute mark if you want to check it out.

Green's contract ends after this season so they wouldn't be on the hook if they fired him.


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 05, 2021 10:42 pm 
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No - but they would be on the hook for the remainder of the season was my point and I don't think paying two coaches is really an option at this stage.

Will check out 31 Thoughts - thanks Tommy!


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 05, 2021 11:01 pm 
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"to sign Toffoli we'd have to move money out and we didn't have the time."

You knew for months approximately what he would be asking. It should not have come as any surprise.

It worked out fine, probably would not have been able to take on Schmidt if he had.

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Last edited by Fogghorn on Sat Feb 06, 2021 12:36 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Fri Feb 05, 2021 11:56 pm 
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Even if it was true, it's a clumsy thing to admit that you couldn't move money out fast enough to sign TT. Just makes you sound bush league.

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PostPosted: Sat Feb 06, 2021 2:40 pm 
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E.L. wrote:
Even if it was true, it's a clumsy thing to admit that you couldn't move money out fast enough to sign TT. Just makes you sound bush league.
Not the sharpest knife in the drawer.


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PostPosted: Sun Feb 07, 2021 12:15 pm 
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Get the impression in the two Leaf games that Miller is pouting about where the team is. While I get that it sucks for him where things are at but he is not helping himself or the team slacking about it, and that sad sack behavior is contagious. Then the coach still gives him PP time when he has the body language he has when he is not trying to score? I may be a fan of the other team but the goalie in me was hot at this guy.


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PostPosted: Sun Feb 07, 2021 4:53 pm 
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Unfortunately that’s nothing new with Miller. He’s an insanely good player but punched his ticket outta NY with indifferent play. Vigneault hated the guy.

It really feels like Green has lost the room now.


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PostPosted: Mon Feb 08, 2021 5:58 pm 
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Hard not to feel bad for Tyler Motte who’s now on IR for the Canucks.

Having the best to a season in his career, he leads all VAN forwards in hits, blocks, & shifts per game - while also being 3rd on the team in goals.

One of the few bright spots.


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 10, 2021 12:59 pm 
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It's becoming a welcome routine to wake up every other morning and my first thought is, "Well, at least the Canucks didn't lose last night!"


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 10, 2021 1:20 pm 
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the Cunning Linguist wrote:
It's becoming a welcome routine to wake up every other morning and my first thought is, "Well, at least the Canucks didn't lose last night!"
:lol: I actually look forward to the days they aren't playing.


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 10, 2021 2:31 pm 
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Logical Progression wrote:
the Cunning Linguist wrote:
It's becoming a welcome routine to wake up every other morning and my first thought is, "Well, at least the Canucks didn't lose last night!"
:lol: I actually look forward to the days they aren't playing.


lol, me too!!!!!!!!!!

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PostPosted: Wed Feb 10, 2021 2:59 pm 
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What did Hughes say last night? I missed it and can't find anything but people's reactions to it.

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PostPosted: Wed Feb 10, 2021 4:45 pm 
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E.L. wrote:
What did Hughes say last night? I missed it and can't find anything but people's reactions to it.
Don't know. I would know if we actually had proper sports radio out here....He did say that he's been playing "ok" on D - which was interpreted by some as being an acceptable level of play, but I don't think that's what he meant. I think he meant he's been ok and ok isn't good enough. Not sure if that's the reference?


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 10, 2021 5:04 pm 
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E.L. wrote:
What did Hughes say last night? I missed it and can't find anything but people's reactions to it.


Here's a quote from 31 Thoughts, maybe this is what they're talking about...

Quote:
10. When it comes to the Canucks, there’s the numbers and there’s the eye test. First, the numbers. According to Sportlogiq, entering last Saturday’s game in Toronto, the Canucks were 31st in even-strength shot attempts against, including from the slot and off the rush. There were low totals in creating scoring chances, limiting scoring chances against, creating offensive-zone possession time and limiting it against them.

For Braden Holtby to openly stare down teammates — that’s really surprising, and an indication of how sideways everything’s gone. Something’s missing, particularly the cohesion/camaraderie that was part of their victories over Minnesota and St. Louis last summer.

After Monday’s 3-1 loss to Toronto, Quinn Hughes said, “We have a lot of new pieces — we lost a lot of players from last year.” That was the Canucks’ 16th game of the season. Even with the loss of practice time and no exhibition games, that’s a long time for a team to still be finding its way. I can’t help but wonder if Travis Green being in the last year of his contract contributes to the overall malaise. The players saw some critical pieces leave in a similar scenario — do they think the same about their coach?


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 11, 2021 3:05 pm 
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Sadly, I think Green will be the first to pay the price here, but this debacle has been JB's making all along. He's had some good drafts, obviously, and some trades that have worked out, but on balance, regression is in full force here. This was a bubble team last season and with some critical pieces gone, Vancouver is probably where it should be - behind Toronto, Montreal, Calgary, Edmonton and Winnipeg and possibly just on par with Ottawa.


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 11, 2021 4:03 pm 
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the Cunning Linguist wrote:
Sadly, I think Green will be the first to pay the price here, but this debacle has been JB's making all along. He's had some good drafts, obviously, and some trades that have worked out, but on balance, regression is in full force here. This was a bubble team last season and with some critical pieces gone, Vancouver is probably where it should be - behind Toronto, Montreal, Calgary, Edmonton and Winnipeg and possibly just on par with Ottawa.


Just a question here regarding Green, whom I really like, but...weren't acquisitions like Beagle done at his behest? I thought I read that Green really wanted him, so Jimmy Boy went and got him. Mind you, that's still on Benning but I just get confused when people have said there's a severe disconnect between coaching and management. I'm not so sure there is.


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 11, 2021 6:01 pm 
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Pokecheque wrote:
the Cunning Linguist wrote:
Sadly, I think Green will be the first to pay the price here, but this debacle has been JB's making all along. He's had some good drafts, obviously, and some trades that have worked out, but on balance, regression is in full force here. This was a bubble team last season and with some critical pieces gone, Vancouver is probably where it should be - behind Toronto, Montreal, Calgary, Edmonton and Winnipeg and possibly just on par with Ottawa.

Just a question here regarding Green, whom I really like, but...weren't acquisitions like Beagle done at his behest? I thought I read that Green really wanted him, so Jimmy Boy went and got him. Mind you, that's still on Benning but I just get confused when people have said there's a severe disconnect between coaching and management. I'm not so sure there is.
Green may have liked him, but Benning did the deal, which was a ghastly move for overall cap management. He's all over that championship pedigree bullshit, even when it comes to 4th line Centers. We had a comparable player in Nic Dowd who is 5 years younger and less than 1/3 the price. Maybe Green wasn't so hot on him or maybe Jimmy just wanted to make a "big name" move for ownership and fans. :lol:


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