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PostPosted: Wed Dec 18, 2019 9:52 am 
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I didn't stay up for it, but the Habs won in Vancouver last night. I guess a goal was called off that drove everyone crazy? Weber continues his torrid play.

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 18, 2019 10:25 am 
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E.L. wrote:
I didn't stay up for it, but the Habs won in Vancouver last night. I guess a goal was called off that drove everyone crazy? Weber continues his torrid play.


OK saw the highlights. Lehkonen got pushed into the goalie by the Vancouver defenceman, puck went in, he was called for goalie interference. I get it. Surprised Habs fans are foaming at the mouth over this.

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 18, 2019 8:26 pm 
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Boy Genius did a breakdown of the uh...breakdown in the Canucks recent play for The Athletic, and cited three major things: Poor dump-and-chase play, forwards failing to cover for defenders who jump into the play, and defensemen failing to move into proper position to receive passes from the forwards in the offensive zone. These are all things they did much better at the beginning of the season.

https://theathletic.com/1466474/2019/12 ... g-canucks/

I'm honestly beginning to wonder if Travis Green really is a good coach. I know he's been given a bloated and not-great roster, but some of the players on this roster are there because he wanted them.


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 18, 2019 9:54 pm 
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Pokecheque wrote:
Boy Genius did a breakdown of the uh...breakdown in the Canucks recent play for The Athletic, and cited three major things: Poor dump-and-chase play, forwards failing to cover for defenders who jump into the play, and defensemen failing to move into proper position to receive passes from the forwards in the offensive zone. These are all things they did much better at the beginning of the season.

https://theathletic.com/1466474/2019/12 ... g-canucks/

I'm honestly beginning to wonder if Travis Green really is a good coach. I know he's been given a bloated and not-great roster, but some of the players on this roster are there because he wanted them.
Which players are those? Jimbo goes first, granted that will only plug the hole for Green for a few more months.


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 18, 2019 10:12 pm 
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Logical Progression wrote:
Which players are those? Jimbo goes first, granted that will only plug the hole for Green for a few more months.


Would Jimbo really go first? The fact he hasn't gone period despite complete and abject failure the past five years or so makes me think he's made of teflon.

I thought I read that Green banged the drum rather loudly for Jay Beagle. Don't know if other overpaid grinders were also guys Green was pining for, but I don't think there's a huge disconnect between GM and coach, and in this case that's a little disconcerting.


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 19, 2019 1:54 am 
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Pokecheque wrote:
Logical Progression wrote:
Which players are those? Jimbo goes first, granted that will only plug the hole for Green for a few more months.
Would Jimbo really go first? The fact he hasn't gone period despite complete and abject failure the past five years or so makes me think he's made of teflon. I thought I read that Green banged the drum rather loudly for Jay Beagle. Don't know if other overpaid grinders were also guys Green was pining for, but I don't think there's a huge disconnect between GM and coach, and in this case that's a little disconcerting.
This is Jimbo's team. 5 consecutive playoff misses has put him front and center in this debate. The playoff appearance in his first year was a hold over from Gillis. The fact that Benning's lasted this long under a trigger happy Aquilini regime has to be some kind of supernatural phenomenon. Drafting Pettersson may have given Benning a grace period, but he's made errors of monumental proportions though FA, cap management and the ever-flawed pro scouting trade channels - setting this franchise back much further than any reasonable draft record could vindicate. He and Weisbrod drove Linden out of town for thinking too "long term" and have proceeded to make decisions that have boot strapped this team into a short term win now mantra far too soon. How much money are they paying professional hockey players NOT to play hockey? Short answer: far too much wasted money. Rumor has it that if certain ELC's reach their contract targets (i.e. Hughes, Petey), the team will need to defer those bonuses to next year as they are close to being capped out for the remainder of this season which creates a knock on effect for the cap into next year. Apparently Ferland being placed on LTIR has given them some small relief.

Dunno, Green seems to be a decent coach overall but not earth shatteringly great. I find it hard to imagine that Green would go before Benning given he's only in his 3rd season behind the bench and has seen some success on the player development and special teams sides. Stranger things have happened I suppose. Benning is on record as stating the goal this season is to make the playoffs. Anything short of that and some management heads will most assuredly roll. #firebenning was the #1 hashtag trending in Canada on the tweeter last night after their loss to the Habs. Does public sentiment carry any leverage these days?


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PostPosted: Fri Dec 20, 2019 6:45 pm 
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I've come around to the idea that firing Green probably has merit. The team has been a tire fire without the puck since November, and I think BG in his article correctly identified some of the issues. I think Benning would pull the trigger to save himself.

The good:
- The PP looks solid - moving Huggy Bear to the first unit has been YUUUUGE. And the second unit has been giving them some timely goals as well. How long will Leivo be out?
- Goaltending 5-on-5 has been good, but I worry that with Demko out, Green will overplay Markstrom and we all know how well that turns out...

The bad:
- Teams are keying on Petterson from his blueline in for most of the season. See Drance's latest Armies article (12/20) in The Athletic.
- Teams are now collapsing on Hughes to take away his drop pass and force him to get rid of the puck as he carries the puck into the neutral zone.
- On the PP, they collapse around Petterson to take away his shot and pass options. It is very frustrating to watch is Boeser, Miller and Horvat remaining glued to their spots during this time - there's almost no movement (except by Hughes) on the PP and it really limits what Petterson can do.
- Boeser seems to be a tick slower in getting his shot off. I feel as though learning to pass around the shot blocking (this goes for Petterson, too) might be a useful thing to learn, and again, some more movement from their linemates would be helpful here.
- Starting to see more defensive miscues from Hughes lead to goals against...
- This team has a long way to go if they want to move on from Alex Edler.

The fugly:
- Team defense has been porous since the end of October, and looks not unlike the the one we've watched the last five or six years.
- PK has been getting picked apart on the regular these last few games.
- Sean Tierney's viz charts reflect these downward trends over the last six weeks.

Goldobin and Baertschi are not good enough to make this team, even as replacements for Ferland and Motte. Never saw that coming.


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 21, 2019 12:52 am 
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I'd be so frustrated if I were a Canucks fan. Three players, all three extremely young and on ELCs, who project to be among the best at their respective positions. It's not a leap to say they could possibly go down as the best Canucks of All Time at their respective positions (the "weak sister" there might be Boeser just because he's gotta compete with Bure, but still). And this dime-store Dracula is surrounding them with a bloated, old, overpaid, and slow as FUCK supporting cast. And I'd argue his so-called stellar draft record some very big hits with Virtanen and Juolevi inching toward Bustville.

A woman whose got some pretty good insights on the Canucks I follow on Twitter did a podcast recently, the pod is called Canucks Speakeasy and she goes by "Jenna Fabulous." I listened to it recently and she nails it on the head as to why Tyler Myers is such an enormously frustrating player. All the size and talent in the world, and yet just doesn't play with the intensity or smarts you'd want in a player like that. The advanced stats folks warned people about this. Of course Jimmy and Johnny didn't listen.

I REALLY want to know how Jake Gardiner went from a shoo-in (reportedly even told a Canucks associate he was coming) to Vancouver opting for Myers instead. What the hell happened there? Imagine Quinn/Tanev/Stetcher/Gardiner as opposed to Quinn/Tanev/Stetcher/Myers. Completely different dynamic there, and they rely a hell of a whole lot less on Edler, who I guess is still good but really should just be a third pairing guy at this point.

As for Green...I just don't know. Friedman said something about the coach and GM not being on the same page but the way he said it, it just sounded like speculation, more like "they BETTER be on the same page this year." There's no indication they're not. And I just don't think it's a good look when a coach of any caliber is "on the same page" with a thoroughly terrible GM. If there was some disconnect, surely we would've heard about it by now.


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 21, 2019 1:03 am 
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FTR I don't think Green is a bad coach, but I'm starting to have my doubts.

Overall, I'm trying to be more analytical and less stodgy in my opinions about various aspects of the game, and IMO, unless they're like, super-elite coaches like Joel Quenneville or just really gawdawful ones like Randy Carlyle, I don't know if a coach really moves the needle too much. It's on the GM and his team to put together a competitive roster, and then it's up to the coach to put that talent in a position to succeed. Basically, let the talent shine and stay out of the damned way.

What I want to see from coaches nowadays is ones who aren't set in their ways, ones who think outside the box. Ones that aren't married to a "system" and most of all, ones who can actually trust a young player or rookie and not rely on a bunch of talentless grinders to win games. Basically everything anathema to the "Mike Babcock" type of coach. Sometimes I think Green is a very forward-thinking guy...sometimes not. I don't pretend to be an expert on him as I don't watch a ton of Canucks games.


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 21, 2019 2:15 pm 
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Agree with the above assessment of Green. How much weight or importance to give each category is really a subjective enterprise at this point.

    Does he 'get it' with young players? Yes.
    Does he communicate effectively and remain accessible to his hockey personnel? Yes.
    Does he manage his team of coaches well? No idea.
    Surrounded by a talented group of coaches? Err. With the exception of Ian Clark, I would say no. Their PP is better this year but likely due to the Hughes addition more than to coaching itself.
    Good with the media? No.
    Earth shattering motivator? No.
    Good on strategy and game planning (i.e The X's and O's)? Not enough to ostensibly move the needle with this roster.
    Good at making in game adjustments? Better than Willie D but by no means 'real good' either.
    Outside the box thinker? Sometimes. Seems open to changing his systems but it often appears as though he could be just throwing darts at the wall.
    'Gifted' student of the game himself? No.


7.2 out of 10.

Willie D was such a train wreck that anything was an upgrade on him, so perhaps that is playing into the equation and a potential reason why the Canuck fanbase has given him a bit of a pass until now.


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 24, 2019 1:46 pm 
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Interesting take last night - who would have projected that a Huggy Bear / Tanev pairing would be the one to shut down McJesus / Draisaitl? I can understand easing Edler back after injury by putting him out there on the 3rd pairing. But Hughes was out against Draisaitl for most of the night and didn't look out of place. Who would have predicted THAT?

I agree that the PP success has more to do with the addition of Hughes; another season together and it will be even more successful, I think. Just having Hughes walk the line and distribute the puck as smoothly as he does makes them look far more dangerous. If they can figure out how to get movement between the forwards without giving away the puck, that should open up some more shooting lanes for everyone.

As great as JT Miller has been, I think Hrudey's criticisms on HNIC were spot on. He's usually good for at least 2 or 3 glaring gaffes that end up being great chances the other way.

Yes, watching Myers can be frustrating. But Fantenburg / Myers is still a big step up from Pouliotte / Gudbranson so perspective. And having Edler on the 3rd pair seems like cheating.

I think that Horvat got away with a kick - if that had been Draisaitl scoring that way, I would have called it a kick... But when does a stopping motion become a kick? I guess if the skate is off the ice?

Here's to the Oilers returning to their usual :steamingpileofcrap:-tastic level of suckitude... :beer:


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 31, 2019 2:54 pm 
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Five straight wins to end the calendar year, powered mainly by a strong PP, great goaltending, and timely secondary scoring. The 5-on-5 play has fallen off a cliff, and remains the most disturbing negative trend.


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 31, 2019 9:01 pm 
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The 2nd Power Play unit of Virt, Gaudette, Pearson, Roussel and Myers has been the most effective difference maker on this mini win streak. The 1st unit is still solid, but they are passing around the perimeter far too much lately looking for that aesthetically pleasing shot.

The most positive sign is the fact that consistent secondary scoring is emerging in the form of Horvat, Pearson, Virtanen and to a lesser extent Josh Leivo and Adam Gaudette - which is also a sign of roster depth -- and this isn't a mirage, but more an indication of long term stability in this group. I also can't believe how many penalties they are drawing with this style of play - like most in the league. I guess it's all about moving your feet and the puck quickly.


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 03, 2020 3:45 pm 
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Yeah, I'm not really sure how that works. On paper, the 2nd unit PP is not all that impressive but somehow they get the job done. I wonder if opposing teams focus so much on locking down Petterson's, and to a lesser extent, Boeser's one-timer on the 1st unit that they ignore the 2nd unit altogether.


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 03, 2020 4:41 pm 
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I don't know about the Canucks, but one downside of rolling out all your best players onto one super-power play unit is that they all get too fancy and try to create the perfect snipe. That's definitely what the Avs were doing of late before Bednar finally split some guys up. They just devolved into a perimeter passing extravaganza with nothing to show for it. After they blew an easy 5-on-3 the other night, Bednar had enough. The units have since responded and lit up the Blues for 3 goals last night.

Sometimes a 2nd unit can get the job done because they tend to keep it simple--shoot it, crash the net, and clean up on the rebounds.


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PostPosted: Sat Jan 11, 2020 5:26 pm 
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https://twitter.com/ThomasDrance/status ... 2530556928

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:


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PostPosted: Sun Jan 19, 2020 1:38 am 
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Nice to know we have an answer for who the best player is to have on the ice when the opposing net is empty: Loui Eriksson.


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 20, 2020 6:59 pm 
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Pokecheque wrote:
I don't know about the Canucks, but one downside of rolling out all your best players onto one super-power play unit is that they all get too fancy and try to create the perfect snipe.

That certainly is spot-on... The #1 unit featuring Huggy Bear seems to be drawing the best and most aggressive PK units...

Pokecheque wrote:
Sometimes a 2nd unit can get the job done because they tend to keep it simple--shoot it, crash the net, and clean up on the rebounds.

Meanwhile, the #2 unit featuring Virtanen, Pearson and Myers just throw pucks at the net and something good happens. That last PP goal against the Sharts was a perfect example. Pearson and VIrtanen saw that the PK defensemen were allowing them to go to front of the net on a zone entry so they did exactly that Virtanen timed a perfect shot-pass on Pearson's stick.

Pokecheque wrote:
Nice to know we have an answer for who the best player is to have on the ice when the opposing net is empty: Loui Eriksson.

Yeah, the Insurance Line (Eriksson, Horvat, Pearson) has been lights out when it comes to cashing in on EN goals... :lol:


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 07, 2020 4:17 pm 
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A thought-provoking and perhaps controversial position by JD Burke: If I'm the Canucks, I'd seriously consider trading Jacob Markstrom at the deadline.

I happen to like this idea a LOT.

I love what Markstrom has done for the Canucks for these past few years, but I have to also consider that this team has no cap space at all to keep all the assets they'd like (Tanev (who i also think they ought to see what the market will bear), Stecher, Virtanen, Gaudette and possibly Leivo among others), while still finding money to get Hughes and Petterson new contracts in 2021. Their current cap situation is a product of GMJB's cap mismanagement and he can't possibly keep everyone he'd like. They can't protect both Markstrom and Demko at the expansion draft two summers from now.

After watching them get shoved around in Boston, then get throttled by Minnesota (!), I don't think they will go more than one round if they do make the playoffs, regardless of who is in goal (Markstrom or Demko). They are still bleeding shots from high-danger areas at far too high a rate and I just don't see them going deep given the inconsistencies in their own zone.

If GMJB can recoup the first rounder he traded to get JT Miller for Markstrom or Demko, I'd say go for it. They've been saying for a while now that Demko is their goalie of the future... He's the right age bracket to go along with Hughes, Petterson, Boeser and Horvat so why not? But, this feels like Luongo/Schneider 2.0 where I'd prefer they trade the older vet near his peak, but it's the younger kid who brings the best return. Given the UFA goalie market this summer, I'd guess that the return will be far lower than a first or second at the trade deadline.


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 07, 2020 5:43 pm 
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Can't believe I'm saying this but...no. Don't do that.

The Pacific has never been softer. The Kings, Sharks, and Ducks all suck donkey balls. The Coyotes are clinging for dear life to a playoff spot. The Flames and Oilers are mediocre at best. That leaves Vegas as the only legitimate threat in the division. This is the prime opportunity to go on a run and claim that division title while it's in reach. Once they're in the Canucks actually have enough flash and talent to go on a run, especially if they get lucky and stay healthy enough. You're not going to get a ton in return for Markstrom as a deadline rental, certainly not enough to justify torpedoing a legit run for the postseason. Cannot believe I am actually endorsing Benning and Aquilini's hare-brained notions but they should stay the course. So what if you lose a good backup goalie for nothing. Get another one and go with Demko after this.


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