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PostPosted: Mon Apr 20, 2015 12:49 pm 
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IF Mcdavid turns out to be that Crosby type guy that will mean the four most dominate players to play since I started watching in the Gretzky Oiler days will have played on two teams. Lame, obviously wanted the Leafs to get him but after that it was anybody but the Oilers.


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 20, 2015 12:52 pm 
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Pittsburgh had Jagr, too.

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 20, 2015 1:42 pm 
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saskhab wrote:
Pittsburgh had Jagr, too.


Pittsburgh deserved him. Four other teams had the chance. Pat Quinn claimed they had him ranked 1st but because there were issues at the time about whether they could get him over here or not they passed and took Nedved 2nd overall. Good call for Pittsburgh taking a risk others wouldn't

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 20, 2015 1:46 pm 
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Fogghorn wrote:
saskhab wrote:
Pittsburgh had Jagr, too.


Pittsburgh deserved him. Four other teams had the chance. Pat Quinn claimed they had him ranked 1st but because there were issues at the time about whether they could get him over here or not they passed and took Nedved 2nd overall. Good call for Pittsburgh taking a risk others wouldn't

All I'm saying is Pittsburgh would be the 5th most dominant forward, not whether they deserved him or not.

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 20, 2015 1:57 pm 
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saskhab wrote:
Pittsburgh had Jagr, too.


Pittsburgh has Malkin too. But I guess we're getting into Messier/Hasek/Lidstrom/Roy kind of territory?

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 20, 2015 2:17 pm 
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Bosc wrote:
saskhab wrote:
Pittsburgh had Jagr, too.


Pittsburgh has Malkin too. But I guess we're getting into Messier/Hasek/Lidstrom/Roy kind of territory?


You mean the we can debate who is better than who territory............forever :) ...........I'd actually put Messier beside Jagr and Lidstrom a touch ahead of both but as Sask mentioned he was just discussing forwards.

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 20, 2015 3:31 pm 
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Jagr > Messier. No doubt about that one. Both in peak and longevity.

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 20, 2015 5:07 pm 
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saskhab wrote:
Jagr > Messier. No doubt about that one. Both in peak and longevity.


15 all-stars, 2 Harts, 1887 NHL points vs 12 all-star, 1 Hart and 1802 NHL points..............I'd say there is reason for 'doubt'. And in regards to longevity Jagr has more years and more professional games played but Messier is #2 in NHL games after only Howe. They're both absolutely incredible in terms of longevity, really not much of an edge to either in this as well.

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 20, 2015 6:35 pm 
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1990s-2010s points >>>>>>> 1980s-2000s points. Messier racked up his prime points in the highest scoring era of all time.

Jagr had 1 Hart but 5 Art Ross' and 3 Pearson's (MVP voted by players). 7 time a First Team All-Star (once a second). His career is more comparable to Gordie Howe's than Messier's based on peak and longevity. He had a greater peak than Messier significantly, as evidenced by the fact Jagr got 149 points in 95/96 (the year after Jersey trapped their way to the Cup) while Messier topped out at 129.

If not for Jagr's KHL sabbatical, he'd be second all time in points already. He still might get there in two years.

Jagr is also second all-time in Even Strength Goals: http://www.hockey-reference.com/leaders ... areer.html

And adjusted for era, Jagr is already 200 points clear of Messier: http://www.hockey-reference.com/leaders ... areer.html

Mess is a two time Hart, two time Pearson (same years), 1 time Conn Smythe, 4 time First Team All-Star (once a second). A phenomenal player, but Jagr is just superior. Put Messier in any era and I don't think you consider him the best player of that period. Jagr was that in his era.

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 20, 2015 11:33 pm 
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How ironic that you guys are talking about Messier vs Jagr in the Junior Forum. :lol:

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 21, 2015 10:05 am 
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Chris18 wrote:
How ironic that you guys are talking about Messier vs Jagr in the Junior Forum. :lol:

This is why I was carrying on this debate. :lol:

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 21, 2015 10:16 am 
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Gare Joyce is saying the unspoken truth right now on Twitter: the industry thinks McDavid > Crosby.

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 21, 2015 10:19 am 
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saskhab wrote:
Gare Joyce is saying the unspoken truth right now on Twitter: the industry thinks McDavid > Crosby.


Seriously? Fuuuuck.

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 21, 2015 10:22 am 
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It'll be interesting to have the most talented F in the NHL in the West again.

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Injustice? Cobain died and Eddy Fucking Vedder lived to haunt us with his shitty fucking voice, trite lyrics and his Eddy Vedderness.

:steamingpileofcrap:

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 21, 2015 10:33 am 
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saskhab wrote:
It'll be interesting to have the most talented F in the NHL in the West again.


I'm curious to see how he does out of the gate. Crosby and Ovechkin's teams didn't see immediate success but the two of them sure saw immediate individual success.

Are we going to see Hall-McDavid-Eberle right off the bat? Will the Oil deal someone?

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 21, 2015 10:43 am 
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The Oil would be dumb to make a deal just for the sake of making a deal. Draisaitl becomes a chip now that they can either use as their Jordan Staal/Mike Ricci type who they can put in the AHL to start his pro career, though.

Oil C depth: RNH, McDavid, Lander, Gordon
Oil RW depth: Eberle, Yakupov, Purcell, Klinkhammer, Pitlick
Oil LW depth: Hall, Pouliot, Hendricks, Gadzic

If they re-up Derek Roy, which they should do since he'll sign cheap and can work well on a 3rd line either at wing or C, that's a legit full NHL forward group with everyone playing on a line that they can do legitimately. So if they traded a young star forward for a D, they'd lose that.

Despite all of the young talent they've accumulated, the Oilers don't yet have a surplus of forward talent. They simply finally have a full compliment of forwards. There are no Pulkkinens here, to put it in Red Wings terms.

I'd look at dealing the Pittsburgh pick (17th/18th overall if Pitt is knocked out by NYR), and they have two seconds as well (Petry pick, their own) plus a bunch of thirds. You should be able to find a quality D with those picks in combo, and possibly a second guy. It's a start at least.

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Injustice? Cobain died and Eddy Fucking Vedder lived to haunt us with his shitty fucking voice, trite lyrics and his Eddy Vedderness.

:steamingpileofcrap:

- Ancient Chinese Proverb


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PostPosted: Tue Jun 16, 2015 12:24 pm 
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Didn't even think of this until someone mentioned it on NHL Radio, the Sabres can't possibly use all the picks they've acquired in this draft, or at least they can't and actually SIGN all the picks since it'd require them going way over the contract limit. So then, what do ya do?


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PostPosted: Tue Jun 16, 2015 12:29 pm 
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Av-merican wrote:
Didn't even think of this until someone mentioned it on NHL Radio, the Sabres can't possibly use all the picks they've acquired in this draft, or at least they can't and actually SIGN all the picks since it'd require them going way over the contract limit. So then, what do ya do?


2 years to sign major juniors. You can delay having to sign European players, can't you? US juniors headed to university. Trade picks in subsequent drafts. There are ways to do it.

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PostPosted: Tue Jun 16, 2015 12:55 pm 
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Bosc wrote:
Av-merican wrote:
Didn't even think of this until someone mentioned it on NHL Radio, the Sabres can't possibly use all the picks they've acquired in this draft, or at least they can't and actually SIGN all the picks since it'd require them going way over the contract limit. So then, what do ya do?


2 years to sign major juniors. You can delay having to sign European players, can't you? US juniors headed to university. Trade picks in subsequent drafts. There are ways to do it.


Yeah you got plenty of time w/NCAA players, of course they can stay long enough to Van Ryn their way to free agency, but that's another story. I forgot you had two years w/junior players, I thought you had only one. No idea on Euro picks.

I'm sure there's ways to do it, just curious how Murray will do it. I suppose you can parlay the picks into players, perhaps a cap casualty or two (HEY ROY, SEND STUART THEIR WAY), and like you said, trade picks now for picks later.


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PostPosted: Tue Jun 16, 2015 1:49 pm 
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4 years for Euro picks.

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Injustice? Cobain died and Eddy Fucking Vedder lived to haunt us with his shitty fucking voice, trite lyrics and his Eddy Vedderness.

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